Canada got FUPed so freaking hard.

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You are a vampiric isp.First you have already stated that you will do away with flat plans,which what canada isps have done and now you have the audacity to say that you will charge youtube.

I hope your hayani pops up like a dream ballon.You will do serious damage.Already aritel started the fup and now you want to start tiered internet.


your true colors are now showing.

You're an idiot. We have not done away with flat-rate plans - where and how did you come up with that idea? I have merely stated that we expect reasonable usage on our flat-rate plans, this is all. I think you'll find that this is a perfectly reasonable request, rather than coming up with a hard-cap FUP like other ISPs have, wouldn't you agree?

Furthermore, we will not be charging Youtube. I am merely stating that we would have the right to do so, unless they want to bring the content in via their own arrangements and then peer with us directly, otherwise we're footing the bill for their bandwidth - a cost which would be passed on to you, the consumer.

We will not be creating or taking part in any kind of tiered internet plan at all - in fact, my stance is quite the opposite: we want to start our own IXP so that all ISPs of India can exchange information freely without it being sent to Singapore or via expensive NIXI links.

HOWEVER, peering and content delivery are very separate businesses. Peers are generally expected to have traffic ratios of about 1:1 in : out - smaller ISPs in India tend towards about 3:1 in : out, however if any peer were to exceed the typical and internationally accepted ratios of 5:1 out : in, then they would no longer be a peer and by sending 5x as much traffic to a network as they receive, then they would be considered to be a content provider or delivery network, which would subject them to different rates. Considering everything, I doubt the rates charged to a content provider would be significantly different to those charged to a peer - a mere nominal difference to denote the type of relationship the two networks have - nothing like 3.7c/GB.

I should also point out that this is not just us, this is the situation at any peering exchange, and is written in to the peering policies of pretty much every ISP I've researched over the last 2 years.

Also, I don't know about this company "Hayani" that you've mentioned, but I can assure you that HAYAI aims to be #1 in customer service and value for money by providing the best services possible and the most reasonable prices we can, without comprimising on quality of service.

In future, I suggest you don't jump to conclusions so quickly and READ what was written. I use the words "in theory" for a reason. It's all hypothetical.
 
But you are only tube carriers.You are not supposed to mess inside the tubes which big isps are starting to do,network neutrality has to be made into law and if you think that your isp cannot handle the load and bandwidth then why give 100mbit plans?.give is 512k ul or 1mbps ul but all protocols have to be neutral.Dammit that's how the internet came into being.NEUTRAL.Also you said that "unless they want to bring the content in via their own arrangements and then peer with us directly, otherwise we're footing the bill for their bandwidth - a cost which would be passed on to you, the consumer."What do you think of p2p streaming.The creator of bittorrent brian cohen will release a new software\protocol which will allow p2p streaming.Wont this address isp's concern or isps want end p2p all togetherFirst it was p2p hogs more than 50% of the bandwidth now it is video streaming.I suggest you to youtube"humanity lobotomy".
 
200GB to 25GB: Canada gets first, bitter dose of metered Internet



In simple terms, it looks like a private company got the government to legalize Fair Usage Policy.



I can see it happening here in India too.


na it wont happen in US unlikely in India already tariff are pretty high here with cos like airtel already at bare min in Fair Usage Policy and speeds of 256Kbps after Fair Usage Policy...crap
 
But you are only tube carriers.You are not supposed to mess inside the tubes which big isps are starting to do,network neutrality has to be made into law and if you think that your isp cannot handle the load and bandwidth then why give 100mbit plans?.give is 512k Unlimited or 1mbps Unlimited but all protocols have to be neutral.


I think you grossly underestimate the role of an ISP in the scheme of things.

Our backbone providers - they're basically just tube carriers.

We give 100mbit/s plans because our network is designed to handle the load. All protocols are neutral - we are not throttling anything, and we will not do so either unless we absolutely have to.


Dammit that's how the internet came into being.NEUTRAL.


Despite what you may think, the Internet is far from Neutral. Even less so in India.

Also you said that
"unless they want to bring the content in via their own arrangements and then peer with us directly, otherwise we're footing the bill for their bandwidth - a cost which would be passed on to you, the consumer."


That's right. Otherwise let's say hypothetically we're paying 1Cr per annum for an STM-1. That works out so say about Rs17/GB.

Now, because all bandwidth at the international level is contended, let's say have to put a Youtube cache inside of our network so as to increase the performance of that particular site, there's still going to be a bill of Rs17/GB for videos to come from Youtube's next-nearest server farm.

Since the cache is inside our network, you, the consumer are no longer going to be paying for that GB of transfer. But we have to charge someone to recoup that cost somehow. Who do you suggest that entity is? Would you rather we charged you for GBs you didn't use? I somehow think that you wouldn't.

What do you think of p2p streaming.The creator of bittorrent brian cohen will release a new software\protocol which will allow p2p streaming.Wont this address isp's concern or isps want end p2p all together


I'm all for it. If a peer is inside the network, then a large percentage of subsequent requests for whatever content is being hosted will remain inside the network, reducing our costs and international bandwidth demands.

First it was p2p hogs more than 50% of the bandwidth now it is video streaming.
I suggest you to youtube"humanity lobotomy".

There comes a point where the few users - whatever they may be doing - are saturating the pipes, and so to ensure a high quality of service to the other 80+% of users, some protocols may have to be throttled, but at the same time we, the ISP, should be doing things to mitigate the effects of things like Youtube, hence all the caching.

---------- Post added at 05:32 PM ---------- Previous post was at 05:31 PM ----------

Just in case you haven't already, re-read my (now expanded) post https://broadband.forum/net-neutrality/65439-canada-got-fuped-so-freaking/#post450921

---------- Post added at 05:38 PM ---------- Previous post was at 05:32 PM ----------

Ahh now I remember where you might have got the idea that we're no longer doing flat-rate plans: I have also said that unlimited is a bad business model.

Which I still think that it is. And Unlimited is also a farce.

However, what the market demands is unlimited, but since nobody can provide truely unlimited (unless you want to spend like Rs15k for a 5mbit/s connection), flat-rate is the next best thing. A little truth in advertising, and we can recommend you the best flat-rate plan based on your intended usage. Our terms on this are more or less "use responsibly and don't be a resource hog".
 
warthog in a Fair Usage Policy battle with mg :D getting popcorn hmm

Hehe.

I think over the past year and a half, I've made my stance on FUPs fairly clear.

I think they suck.

I don't want any on my network.

But...

I'll do whatever I have to do ensure a high-quality of service to all customers, which will probably mean some bandwidth throttling on some users during certain hours of the day or something to that effect, maybe, but due to oodles of caching, most users probably won't notice it except maybe on Bittorrent, even though we are caching torrent traffic with a rather interesting P2P caching system and running our own tracker... OR suggesting that continuously excessive users upgrade their plans to something "more appropriate to their usage levels" et cetera.

I've gone over it before in other [Hayai] threads, and I don't really feel the need to go over it again here.
 
in the end warthog is a college going kid with no idea about the real world and the concept of running a real business. he is living in a delusional world believing that he can escape the claws of the government. :D
 
You are a vampiric isp.First you have already stated that you will do away with flat plans,which what canada isps have done and now you have the audacity to say that you will charge youtube.

I hope your hayani pops up like a dream ballon.You will do serious damage.Already aritel started the Fair Usage Policy and now you want to start tiered internet.


your true colors are now showing.

while u r right from cust point of view i would really suggest to read mg's quote below with a calm mind and u will understand that what he said is not wrong. Besides he was talking abt charging youtube and not the cust

Now keep in mind that even if I have a Youtube or Netflix cache in my network, the videos still have to be able to get from Netflix/Youtube's main servers to my network, somehow. And if Netflix and Youtube aren't going to pony up any cash for bandwidth, who is? Am I expected to pay? What benefit is my company going to get out of it? Is Netflix or Youtube going to share some revenue with me? Not likely.

damn i missed a few posts . it seems that opera is not loading the pages correctly and showing old data. should have used FF
 
^ this guy has my thumbs up :D

...dare I also mention that the aforementioned torrent tracker is live and accessible to Hayai's IP ranges already? (It is exclusively for Hayai customers, and works kinda the same as thebox.bz with ratio watch and hashed user IDs in the tracker url and so forth).

...doesn't have any torrents tracked on it yet, though, cause, ya know... launch is needed and torrents will have to be added by users.
 
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