A discussion on poor internet speeds and awful broadband plans in India

[KurianOfBorg]

Salaries haven't increased for years now in most companies. Inflation is anywhere between 10% - 100% a year depending on the product.
I am not sad about the salaries part. It's good that after this useless Indian IT bubble, finally idiot employees are not getting what they don't deserve and that the (incompetent at their) job market shrunk by 30% since last year thanks to the severe power cuts in south India.

 

[Saurab k]

to add to the second posters point, i have 10 mbps line which gives me more than 15 mbps most of the time and its free !! works like a cherm.. and I used to pay INR 1500 for 2 mbps in India

to add to the second posters point, i have 10 mbps line which gives me more than 15 mbps most of the time and its free !! works like a cherm.. and I used to pay INR 1500 for 2 mbps in India

Yes you pay 1500 for 2mbps False plan The fact is its 256 kbps sorry brother your pay 1500 for 256kbps for 28 days

 

[Saurab k]

America The National Broadband Plan, unveiled March 16, 2010,was a Federal Communications Commission (FCC) plan to improveInternet access in the United States. One goal was providing 100 million American households with access to 100 Mbit/s (megabits per second) connections by 2020. The American Recovery and Reinvestment Act of 2009(ARRA) required that the FCC draft the National Broadband Plan. After the FCC complied with this requirement, the author of that portion of the Act, U.S. Representative Edward J. Markey (D-MA) issued a statement that the FCC had provided a "roadmap" that would "ensure that every American has access to the tools they need to succeed.ARRA did not give the FCC specific jurisdiction to carry out a national broadband plan or to amend theuniversal service provisions of the Telecommunications Act of 1996, but it required that the FCC draft a plan to "include a detailed strategy for achieving affordability and maximizing use of broadband to advance consumer welfare, civic participation, public safety and homeland security,community development, health care delivery, energy independence and efficiency, education, employee training, private sector investment, entrepreneurial activity, job creation and economic growth, and other national purposes.An official website for the plan, broadband.gov, highlighted energy and environment features. Other goals listed were "21st century care", "economic opportunity", "health care", "civic engagement" and "public safety". Broadband maps, tests and reporting of "broadband dead zones" were also featured. The plan called for broadcasters to give up spectrum forwireless broadband access.Large areas of the United States would be wired for Internet access, and the federal Rural Utilities Service providing some rural areas with landline telephone service would be upgraded. The Obama administration promoted the plan.FCC Chairman Julius Genachowski, named the plan "his top priority"

If you think that 20-30mbit/s Internet is all about only browsing or piracy, you have a limited imagination. There could be a world of opportunities for the enterprising person should high-bandwidth services become the norm in India.

The goals of the plan are described on broadband.gov:At least 100 million U.S. homes should have affordable access to actual download speeds of at least 100 megabits per second and actual upload speeds of at least 50 megabits per second by the year 2020.The United States should lead the world in mobile innovation, with the fastest and most extensive wireless networks of any nation.Every American should have affordable access to robust broadband service, and the means and skills to subscribe if they so choose.Every American community should have affordable access to at least 1 gigabit per second broadband service to anchor institutions such as schools, hospitals, and government buildings.To ensure the safety of the American people, every first responder should have access to a nationwide, wireless, interoperable broadband public safety network.To ensure that America leads in the clean energy economy, every American should be able to use broadband to track and manage their real-time energy consumption.

 

[Saurab k]

The examples about Centurylink DSL was based on Houston, TX and Frontier on St Louis, MO, so no, I'm not comparing rural America with modern India. I am comparing similar places - somewhere like Chicago to somewhere like Mumbai; or some mid-sized town in Michigan to some mid-sized town in Karnataka.FWIW, in the US, Chicago was one of the *worst* Internet experiences in the whole country, even with all the Starbucks and McDonalds and everywhere with free wifi. Even plugging directly in to a Comcast box it was hideous. I actually had better connectivity in some bum-town in Michigan than I did almost anywhere in Chicago.Additionally, like India, prices are generally uniform - I'm going to pay approximately the same for a standard 512k package on BSNL in Jaipur as I will in Trivandrum in the same way I'm going to pay for the basic-rate Broadband on any given ISP (let's take AT&T as an example) in the US.Whoever told you this has misled you.

you typing totally wrong . its make no sense dont miss guide other kindly. talk the facts. typing can satisfy your frustration but cannot satisfy your soul

 

[Saurab k]

mr mgcarley read the topic.

 

[Saurab k]

Fingerpointing at the government? Pointless.For the most part, they are a bunch of people who have no fricken idea about Broadband and it's value or even the fact that it's wanted. You could talk to them about it until you're blue in the face and all they'll do is just say "oh" and then offer you Rs100 for your vote in the next election.An attitude not unlike this.Sure, they have made some wonderful plans in the past, but they well over 50% short of the 2004 plan in terms of numbers. Why is that?Local infrastructure is a bitch to lay - and expensive. First you get the government's approval. Then the city. Then the ward. Then the society. And there's ALWAYS going to be someone meddling - whether it's just that he doesn't want his already wonky driveway to have a teeny little 2cm wide cut in it (to be filled with grout) or that he doesn't want his driveway to be obstructed for even 4 seconds despite the fact that he'll be at work all day because he or someone he knows is a VIP somewhere... or the society doesn't want it's fence which is already covered in bird droppings to have a piece of plastic piping screwed to it for cosmetic reasons or... or... or... you need to pay us for electricity (even when the equipment is completely passive and doesn't use any)... the list goes on...And if it's long-haul infra, well, let's just announce the creation of another network because... taxpayers!! Despite the fact that at least 4 government entities have lakhs of KMs of fibre - much of it unused - all over the country... never mind the price per KM that they want to lease capacity is insulting.And fingerpointing at the ISPs? They're just there to make money... most users are uneducated about the availability of services according to the rest of the world, but hey, this is India, and India is *always* different (apparently), so if it's wireless, we blame the spectrum. If it's wired, it's the difficulty of laying new cables or leasing space on existing ones (assuming the owner of said cables likes you, he might give you a price which is slightly less obscene than it would be otherwise).Yeah... it's not just one entity at fault, and they'll all blame each other. I too am guilty of this. So you can imagine the futility of pointing the finger

Fingerpointing at the government is not a crime its your Right to ask . your talking about burgers and patties you eat and use there free Wifi .do you know how much you pay tax for 1 burger .how know much every indian pay tax everyday . Yes i point My finger on indian gov nose if i dont like anything in my country they work for us. we made them . you need to learn more before typing Go learn about it then talk See the Conversation then type. mr mgcarley

 

---

[mgcarley]

Yes you pay 1500 for 2mbps False plan The fact is its 256 kbps sorry brother your pay 1500 for 256kbps for 28 days

Someone is getting his bits and bytes mixed up. 256kBytes [what your computer reports you downloading] = 2mbit/s [what the ISP advertises]

 

[mgcarley]

America The National Broadband Plan, unveiled March 16, 2010,was a Federal Communications Commission (FCC) plan to improveInternet access in the United States. One goal was providing 100 million American households with access to 100 Mbit/s (megabits per second) connections by 2020. The American Recovery and Reinvestment Act of 2009(ARRA) required that the FCC draft the National Broadband Plan. After the FCC complied with this requirement, the author of that portion of the Act, U.S. Representative Edward J. Markey (D-MA) issued a statement that the FCC had provided a "roadmap" that would "ensure that every American has access to the tools they need to succeed.ARRA did not give the FCC specific jurisdiction to carry out a national broadband plan or to amend theuniversal service provisions of the Telecommunications Act of 1996, but it required that the FCC draft a plan to "include a detailed strategy for achieving affordability and maximizing use of broadband to advance consumer welfare, civic participation, public safety and homeland security,community development, health care delivery, energy independence and efficiency, education, employee training, private sector investment, entrepreneurial activity, job creation and economic growth, and other national purposes.An official website for the plan, broadband.gov, highlighted energy and environment features. Other goals listed were "21st century care", "economic opportunity", "health care", "civic engagement" and "public safety". Broadband maps, tests and reporting of "broadband dead zones" were also featured. The plan called for broadcasters to give up spectrum forwireless broadband access.Large areas of the United States would be wired for Internet access, and the federal Rural Utilities Service providing some rural areas with landline telephone service would be upgraded. The Obama administration promoted the plan.FCC Chairman Julius Genachowski, named the plan "his top priority"The goals of the plan are described on broadband.gov:At least 100 million U.S. homes should have affordable access to actual download speeds of at least 100 megabits per second and actual upload speeds of at least 50 megabits per second by the year 2020.The United States should lead the world in mobile innovation, with the fastest and most extensive wireless networks of any nation.Every American should have affordable access to robust broadband service, and the means and skills to subscribe if they so choose.Every American community should have affordable access to at least 1 gigabit per second broadband service to anchor institutions such as schools, hospitals, and government buildings.To ensure the safety of the American people, every first responder should have access to a nationwide, wireless, interoperable broadband public safety network.To ensure that America leads in the clean energy economy, every American should be able to use broadband to track and manage their real-time energy consumption.

Won't happen. The US and India are very similar in that they have very fragmented last miles. It's going to take more than 6 years to unbundle and/or consolidate and/or upgrade all of them. There are some admirable efforts going on, but there are also some places where private companies are making it *impossible* (to the point of getting laws passed) for municipalities to build out their own fibre networks.

you typing totally wrong . its make no sense dont miss guide other kindly. talk the facts. typing can satisfy your frustration but cannot satisfy your soul

I'm wrong, huh? What did I write exactly that isn't a fact? And please cite your sources. I already did mine, and it was based on observation from actually being in the US. Where I happen to be sitting as I write this.

mr mgcarley read the topic.

I did. Did you?

Fingerpointing at the government is not a crime its your Right to ask . your talking about burgers and patties you eat and use there free Wifi .do you know how much you pay tax for 1 burger .how know much every indian pay tax everyday . Yes i point My finger on indian gov nose if i dont like anything in my country they work for us. we made them . you need to learn more before typing Go learn about it then talk See the Conversation then type. mr mgcarley

I never said it was a crime or that it isn't your right, I'm saying it's pointless. There is a difference. Although, I'm not actually sure you read what I had to say. Just to refresh your memory, what I said was that the free WiFi around the place was not good. Fact. (Also, I don't pay any taxes on burgers because I don't eat fast food, it just so happens that the wifi hotspots are there). I also tried a private Comcast connection in Chicago. It was OK but not stellar. Fact. I used another connection in Flint, Michigan and it was (surprisingly) good. Fact. As mentioned, I've been all over the place in the US & Canada in the last few months and generally speaking, have been less than impressed, even discounting the aforementioned free wifi spots.
Besides, what does this free wifi have to do with the government and/or taxes? Exactly zero. AT&T (who does most of the WiFi hotspots around the place) is under no governmental obligation to provide free Internet via McDonalds or Barnes and Noble or Starbucks - it's an enterprise thing - usually a loss-leader for the stores concerned.
Moreover, I'm not sure if you actually realize that I am tax-resident in India, as is my company and my staff... I know I pay a LOT more than the average Indian taxpayer, but that's not really got much to do with the conversation... You saying I need to learn more about India and/or the industry in which I am a player (albeit a very small one) when you are mixing up your bits and bytes is... an interesting opinion, to say the least.
If you're going to accuse me of telling fibs about the situation in a given location that I've been to or experienced Internet services in (especially one where I happen to be sitting at this moment) then by all means do so - but back it up with some evidence.

 

[OneWithTheForce]

Fallacy.In India:1. Piracy of Indian content is against the law, piracy of foreign content, not so much.2. Sites offering pirated materials regularly get blocked.3. The government openly and actively spies on you. ISPs are REQUIRED BY LAW to have the equivalent of room 641a in their NOC4. Law enforcement has been known to crack down on bloggers, activists, journalists and people who say bad things about certain political families. In some cases, they have also got innocents.In the US/Norway/etc:1. Piracy is a civil matter, not a crime - no matter what they tell you. Yes, some people get letters, but they're not "next day"... in the USA I believe they were going for "6 strikes".2. I've seen less blocking of pirate sites in the US and Europe than in India, and often when a site like TPB is blocked, someone opens a mirror or proxy.3. Yes, the NSA spies, but this is no different from almost any other country on any other continent these days.4. There are certain rights granted to bloggers, activists, journalists and people who say bad things about certain political families. Law enforcement doesn't often go around jailing people at random unlike India.

The NSA have direct access to fiber cables in the U.S. They're literally running out of storage because of the amount of data they're collecting.
It IS different from another country,because no one else has the resources to collect the amount of data that the U.S does. Or use that data in an effective manner.
With India,it's much more transparent. Internet and social networking have only very recently become part of mainstream India,there are still people who hold conservative views on it and because of these factors there isn't a real system or method on dealing with any issues arising from it. In the future,as more of these cases pop up,that will change.
I think an important but ignored reason for the poor condition of Internet here is mainly because of the exploitative nature of the average Indian user. I've seen quite a lot of people on here who use mere 1/2 mbps plans to download easily more than 500gb per month. Give them higher bandwidth and they'll just keep on consuming more atrocious amounts of data. The fact that most of that is probably pirated too only makes it worse.
At least in America,you have extremely good latency. And as far as I know,if you're willing to pay enough,you can get high speed plans. In most parts of India,that's not true.
Internet speed right now isn't even close to usable,so we'll have to improve. Whether the U.S is worse or not,doesn't change anything.

 

[mgcarley]

The NSA have direct access to fiber cables in the U.S. They're literally running out of storage because of the amount of data they're collecting.It IS different from another country,because no one else has the resources to collect the amount of data that the U.S does. Or use that data in an effective manner.

The Indian government has direct access to fiber cables in India as well. They require every ISP to have a 10sqft room in the NOC which is not accessible to employees of the ISP containing the required equipment, and the access is not allowed to be slowed down or filtered - so I can't just put a 2 meg pipe in to that room, it has to be 100mb or 1ge or 10ge or whatever my backbone is.Also, the NSA just built a shiny new data centre. They have enough space now.

With India,it's much more transparent. Internet and social networking have only very recently become part of mainstream India,there are still people who hold conservative views on it and because of these factors there isn't a real system or method on dealing with any issues arising from it. In the future,as more of these cases pop up,that will change.

You'd be surprised.

I think an important but ignored reason for the poor condition of Internet here is mainly because of the exploitative nature of the average Indian user. I've seen quite a lot of people on here who use mere 1/2 mbps plans to download easily more than 500gb per month. Give them higher bandwidth and they'll just keep on consuming more atrocious amounts of data. The fact that most of that is probably pirated too only makes it worse.

Firstly, that would be impossible. 512kbit/s allows for a maximum of 160GB in a month. 500GB would be about 1.7mbit/s.Secondly, I find the opposite to be true. Yes, there have been instances of people (ahem... including myself) where they've consumed a terabyte in a month or so but it's rare - in part due to limited HD space and in part due to the reality that trying to maintain that kind of usage month after month is a chore.I've had 100mbit/s at my home in Mumbai for about 2 years now and before that when I was living in Europe (before Hayai) I had 20 and 100mbit/s connections... I'm a pretty heavy user but even I can't be bothered to keep up with it.In fact, I would say that a user jumping from 512k or 1mbit/s to 100mbit/s gets so overwhelmed with the size of his pipe that when all his stuff gets finished, then his hard drive is full, and now it's actually time to consume all that data... he can only do that so quickly. That's why my view on the FUP is "don't waste bandwidth" rather than "here, have 50GB and be happy with that before we reduce you to 256k".

At least in America,you have extremely good latency. And as far as I know,if you're willing to pay enough,you can get high speed plans. In most parts of India,that's not true.

Being in the US at the moment, I can safely tell you that this is absolutely not true. I'm situated in the mid-west (Illinois) on a business-grade line, and my latency to the east coast is 70ms if I'm lucky (distance: about 1,200km, or similar to Mumbai-Delhi - and I can get ~40ms from Mumbai to Delhi). To the west coast, I'm getting... 90-100ms (distance: 3,500km)... which is much more reasonable, actually.I'm trying to get a 100mbit/s fibre line installed at my current location and it's proving VERY difficult at any cost - even though I'm going to be spending around $1,500 per month (which is outrageously expensive for 100mbit/s in the US, despite my asking for and receiving a substantial discount on the average price of $25/mbit/month and considering the wholesale price is less than $1/mbit). One company even offered me 3x 30mbit bonded copper lines at something like $2,700/month.And I'm not in the middle of nowhere, either, I'm in a town not entirely unlike Chattanooga or Kansas City.On the other hand, if I want to pay 30 lakhs a year, I could probably get an STM-1 delivered nearly anywhere in the country.

Internet speed right now isn't even close to usable,so we'll have to improve. Whether the U.S is worse or not,doesn't change anything.

I agree, however, it's still a poor yardstick by which to measure anything. I still maintain that the gov't is going about things the wrong way, worrying about "minimum speeds of broadband" and so on, whereas in one of the previous posts up here, this Saurab fellow even pointed out the goals that the US has, being that households should have at least 100mbit/s available to them at reasonable prices.There is a subtle, yet important difference. Nobody in the US really seems to give a hoot (and in some cases, even know) that the minimum speed of broadband is 768k or so - that really doesn't matter, it's just generally accepted that when applying for a connection, it's going to be faster than that. What they do care about is "how fast can I get" and "how much will it cost" - as in, give me a reasonable price/performance ratio (eg not $80 for 1mbit/s DSL) and we're good.If the Indian gov't were to mandate that providers had to have 100mbit/s available at reasonable prices (83k or 2lakhs/mo isn't reasonable), this could have the potential to change the landscape. But as of now, all anyone does is worry about access at 512kbit/s.